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Episode #144: 'Advancing Michigan's Energy Vision' with Laura Sherman, President of Michigan Energy Innovation Business Council [an Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast]

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In the state of Michigan, the concurrent goals of clean energy, the electrification of cars, and advancing the grid have taken center stage, with innovation being the common theme throughout. To guide that critical conversation, a unique and critical central authority has been the Michigan Energy Innovation Business Council (EIBC). This influential stakeholder and influencing organization doesn't have a counterpart in many other states, but the success it has seen has been exceedingly noteworthy. To learn more about how the Michigan EIBC influences the state's energy landscape, this episode of the Energy Central Power Perspectives Podcast welcomes Laura Sherman, the President of the organization.

During the conversation, Laura offers insights into the Michigan EIBC's unique approach to energy policy and how it strikes a balance between advocating for its members and collaborating with utilities. Listen in as Laura delves into the intricate landscape of Michigan's energy policies, sharing with podcast host Jason Price and producer Matt Chester all of the achievements of the EIBC and how Midwestern values guide their decisions. The captivating discussion focuses on the fusion of business and policy, as well as the pivotal role of the EIBC in advancing Michigan's energy goals.

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Thanks to the sponsor of this episode of the Energy Central Power Perspectives Podcast: West Monroe.  

 

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TRANSCRIPT

Jason Price:

Welcome to the Energy Central Power Perspectives podcast, the show that brings leading minds from the energy industry to discuss the challenges and trends that are transforming and modernizing our energy system. And a quick thank you to West Monroe, our sponsor of today's show. Now, let's talk energy.

I'm Jason Price, Energy Central podcast host and director with West Monroe, coming to you from New York City. And with me as always, from Orlando, Florida, is Energy Central producer and community manager, Matt Chester.

Matt, the energy industry seems to be constantly in the headlines related to state and federal energy policy. How closely are the members of the Energy Central community paying attention to the world's policies and regulations of the energy industry today?

 

Matt Chester:

Jason, I honestly don't know if there's a community out there watching energy industry policy more closely than our Energy Central members. Definitely ranks among the top most frequently discussed topics on our platform and when hot content comes out related to policy and regulation, it undoubtedly spurs the most conversation and debate. And it's rightfully so given how much the decisions made by governments and policymakers will impact the ability of utilities to meet their concurrent goals of reliability, affordability, and sustainability among others. So it goes without saying the same fervor from our audience applies when it comes to policy-focused episodes of this podcast. So I can already feel our listeners strapping in for this one.

 

Jason Price:

Well, that's great intel. Thanks, Matt. Well, the leader we're going to be hearing from today is actually guiding energy policy, albeit behind the scenes in the state of Michigan. Specifically, I'm excited to welcome to the episode Laura Sherman, the president of the Michigan Energy Innovation Business Council, or EIBC. Michigan EIBC is the business voice for advanced energy in the state of Michigan. And the group works for its members, which include renewable and energy storage companies, energy efficiency implementers, EV stakeholders, and more, to foster opportunities for innovation and business growth in the emerging energy technologies that will make up the sector of the future. Laura will share firsthand the achievements and influence Michigan EIBC has made in the state's energy transformation. I've had the great fortune to meet Laura at Michigan area conferences for advancing energy so it's truly great to now spotlight the work she and her team are doing for our podcast audience.

Laura Sherman, welcome to the Energy Central Power Perspectives podcast.

 

Laura Sherman:

Thank you, Jason. Good to be here with you guys.

 

Jason Price:

Laura, let's start with the basics for those who may not be familiar with the Michigan energy landscape. Can you explain further what exactly the Michigan Energy Innovation Business Council is, its goals, and how it operates?

 

Laura Sherman:

So Michigan EIBC is a trade organization. We have more than 160 member companies at this point, and they're from companies all across the advanced energy industry. So you mentioned energy storage developers, wind and solar, utility scale solar companies, community solar companies, rooftop solar, energy efficiency, all manner of the electric vehicle space, from the manufacturers to the charger who fix the chargers, combined heat and power, biomass, all across the sector. We do not have utility members. That's sort of our only rule.

But we work mostly in Michigan at the state level to try to set policies, again, at the state level in Michigan that are going to help our members, help the industry grow. So figuring out what is going to support the industry across all those different sectors and then translating that into policies that we can then advocate for in terms of new state laws, in terms of changes at the regulatory body at the Michigan Public Service Commission and outcomes of utility cases at the Commission, and with the state administration through things like the state budget and the implementation of key state programs. So we're, as you said at the beginning, we try to be the business voice for the advanced energy industry and broadly represent the voice of the industry in all of those key policy discussions.

 

Jason Price:

That's great, Laura. Thanks for setting the stage for us. And now before we dig into the work being done, I'd also love to ask you to share your background with our audience. What was the pathway you took to becoming the president of this important organization and what does your role entail?

 

Laura Sherman:

Yeah. So probably like many people, I have a non-traditional path to get where I am now. I have a undergrad degree in geology and after my undergrad, I got a PhD from University of Michigan focusing on pollution from things like coal-fired power plants. So I was studying mercury pollution in the environment. Really wanted to learn more about energy policy, wanted to learn how I could really impact the world today beyond the academic year.

Went and did a fellowship in Washington, D.C. through the American Academy for the Advancement of Science, AAAS. Which helps put scientists who have a PhD and very specific scientific training but very limited policy experience in positions to learn and to try to be helpful at the federal government. So I was a fellow in the office of Senator Michael Bennet from Colorado. Ended up staying and working for him for a couple of years covering his energy, environment, and agriculture policy. So everything from genetically modified food to wildfires to wind and solar tax credits. So got a really broad view of energy policy at the federal level.

And then wanted to come back to Michigan and dig a little bit more into policy, a little bit less of the politics, although we do plenty of politics here. And so I actually came back to Michigan and started off as a senior consultant at 5LakesEnergy, which is a small energy policy consulting firm in Michigan. And learned from some amazing folks including Douglas Jester, who's still a partner there, and Liesle Clark, who is most recently the director of the Department of Environment, Great Lakes, and Energy here in Michigan, Jamie Scripps.

And learned a ton from them and pretty soon while I was working with them, started helping with EIBC. Liesle at that time was the president of EIBC. And I started helping EIBC, especially with our regulatory work at the Michigan Public Service Commission. And then in 2019, when Liesle was appointed by the governor to lead the Department of Environment, Great Lakes, and Energy, we call it EGLE, in case I used that acronym later. So I applied and was lucky enough to be selected as the board to take on the president role from there.

We've been growing quite a lot, I guess, for a small organization. We have five staff now and we are hiring another one hopefully soon. And I'm trying to make sure that all of our work in all these different venues is continuing forward and consistent and responsive to our members. And then we have a incredible staff who specialize in each of the different areas that we work on. And I tend to still lead our regulatory work in addition to the broader management pieces.

 

Jason Price:

That's great, Laura. And many of the names that you've mentioned, certainly they're recognizable in Michigan. It's the who's who of the Michigan energy scene, so your exposure and involvement with key people in the industry, which is great.

One of the reasons I wanted to spotlight your work and the work of MEIBC is because it's a somewhat unique organization in the functions that you do. For all our listeners across the country listening into this conversation about MEIBC, are there other organizations like the Michigan EIBC in the United States that are parallel to you? What, in your opinion, makes the Michigan landscape right for an organization like yours to thrive?

 

Laura Sherman:

Yeah, it is somewhat unique, organizations like ours in other states, definitely not in every state. In some of the states where there is a clean energy business trade presence, sometimes it's through a branch of a national partner. So we have national partners we work with very closely. For example, Advanced Energy United, the Solar Energy Industries Association. And in some states, they have a branch or a person in a given state that fills a role like this. And sometimes it's a full organization, sometimes it's just one person, and that's obviously a much limited capacity. And then in some other states, like there's a group called ACE New York. It's even quite a bit bigger organization than ours, built out, but a similar trade organization. And then there are some that are hybrid organizations between businesses and environmental groups, such as, I believe some of the ones in Wisconsin and Minnesota. Every group is a little bit different. Some of them also focus on specific technologies. I think the broad trade organization that's only businesses that focuses on all the technologies is a little bit more rare.

We came about, we were actually founded after the folks that actually founded 5LakesEnergy, they were all employees or appointees in the Granholm administration when Governor Granholm was in Michigan, before she was Secretary Granholm. Governor Granholm, I think in 2010 or '11, brought together some of the clean energy businesses in the state and encouraged them that they needed to be coordinated, they needed to work together to have their voice heard at the state level. When she was no longer in office, the folks who worked with her started 5LakesEnergy, including Liesle Clark and Skip Pruss and Douglas Jester. They saw the need for a business trade organization to be that voice of the industry. And so 5LakesEnergy actually founded EIBC in 2011 with a dozen members or so, some of which we still have. And it's really fun to go over the growth story from those 12 to 160 with those original members.

But I'm not sure that Michigan is a unique place to do this. I think it's a great story of growing our power, that we've managed to do over time and really realized the goals that I think Governor Granholm originally had. But really to bring the businesses together behind the scenes, to reach an agreement, to compromise, and then provide that voice to policymakers in the all-boats-rise spirit. Set the stage appropriately with policy so that then everybody can compete. And once they're competing, then those of us setting the policies step aside and may the best technology or company or process or whatnot win. But let's set the right stage.

I think that answers your question. I might've deviated a little bit. Let me know.

 

Jason Price:

No, you got it. That was great, Laura. And mentioning Secretary Granholm, I think it's another example of demonstrating how Michigan punches above its weight in the energy field. So I'm glad you recognized your former governor and our current Secretary of Energy.

So Laura, you shared with us when we were planning this episode that you believe what you call Midwestern values comes into play in how you drive results, specifically in your efforts to keep ugliness out of the public eye and an emphasis on the willingness to compromise. Can you speak to how that comes into play in practicality? And how do you think there's lessons there that others in the wider energy policy community need to take from the way you do all these things?

 

Laura Sherman:

Yeah. So, I haven't worked in other states but I have gotten some feedback from members the way we do things in Michigan and with Michigan EIBC is pretty unique. We have a very clear policy that every member is equally important to us. We don't have a model that allows voices that contribute more to have more of a say. Everybody's opinion and voice is important. And not to say that we can't make decisions because we always have to reach compromise, I don't think that's true. But I think that we really try to be creative and come to a compromise solution behind the scenes in a place that benefits everyone without allowing that to be in the public eye. And I think that that benefits the industry immensely, because a lot of the division or things that we disagree on may be just a matter of business model and may be a matter of looking at a short-term versus a long-term, or maybe in some cases a misunderstanding. And when we are able to break that down in a way that respects each other behind the scenes, we can get to really good conclusions.

So, I haven't seen what this looks like in other states and other trade organizations, but I've had enough people remark that, "The discussion is different here and the way that you guys run it is different," that I do believe that that's true. And whether that's the Midwestern values, I'm from New York actually, Jason, I'm from Upstate New York, and so I have some New Yorker in me. But the Michigan nice has rubbed off on me for long enough, I guess. Maybe I've adopted that way of going. And I think it tends to end up with better results, at least what we've seen. And come to those compromises, then I think results in getting things done. We're really focused on practical results and not in just setting a standard that we can't accomplish or we can't get done, but instead on figuring out what we can get done that will really help everybody.

 

Jason Price:

Well, Laura, I've met you in person, so you still have that New York edge, but of course you have that Michigan sweetness.

 

Laura Sherman:

Thank you for saying that. Appreciate it.

 

Jason Price:

My next question, you can pass if you prefer to, but it's around the relationship that the EIBC has with the utilities in Michigan or the utility industry in general. Could you share with us, so how do you strike a balance in what you're doing without turning it into a us versus them mentality, and how do you feel that the utilities view you and think of you as well as even the Commission thinks of your role and how much engagement do you have with both of these parties?

 

Laura Sherman:

Yeah, so I think that our members all have relationship with the utilities and they're not all the same. So, our members who are developers want to sell projects or sign contracts with the utilities. Our members who are in the electric vehicle charging space want to work with the utilities and site host to make sure there's funding to build out chargers. Our members who are implementing energy waste reduction programs are doing that on behalf of utilities. Our members who are rooftop solar companies are needing to get interconnection agreements with utilities.

So, as a result, I think that a lot of the value that we provide is we can push the utilities to go a little bit farther than they might want to go a little bit faster than they might want to go with a little bit different plan than they might want to have on behalf of our members but without our members doing that. We're not acting on behalf of one member, we're acting on behalf of all of our members. We're able to then be that tip of the spear to push.

And I think that, but at the same time, we're really practical, already said, we're always seeking compromise. We are the kind of voice in a settlement discussion that yeah, we're probably pushing the utilities to do things they don't want to do. But we're always willing to talk, we're always willing to come up with a compromise, we're always willing to be reasonable. We're not going to be yelling at them in the press, we're not going to be over the top rhetoric. We want to be partners and we want to achieve shared goals. We just might have a different path to get there or a slightly different speed at which we want to get there. But I think there's a lot of things that we work well with them on.

And I also think that the people at the utilities, like people everywhere, we have great relationships with a lot of them. We work with them on different things. If we're having a conflict on one area, that doesn't carry over to another area where we do have agreement in general. And so I think that I don't know how they view us. I think that in some cases they may be tired of us pushing on the same things that they don't agree with. I'm tired of them pushing on the same things that I don't agree with, that we don't agree with. And so I hope that there's a mutual respect. I think that they realize that we are punching above our weight, and I think that we are doing that because our weight is actually 160 member companies. It's not five people and a board. It's actually all of our member companies. And when we really truly represent them, we then carry their power with us.

And I think the other part of your question with the Commission. We have engagement daily probably with the Commission. That takes many forms. We're participating in open comment dockets, we intervene in many of the cases of the Commission. We've also been instrumental in helping get the current commissioners appointed and in helping to educate the commission and the staff on the latest and greatest in the industry. I think our members are really eager and we create a lot of opportunities for them to tell the commissioners and the staff about the latest thing in each specific industry sector, which I think really, I'm hopeful that that helps the Commission make sure they're relevant, make sure they're thinking about the latest of what's going on, and they hear from the utilities all the time too. So, providing them with that education, I think, has been really valuable.

 

Jason Price:

That was very helpful. Laura, what you're saying, I'm hearing a lot of, there's a degree of art, there's a degree of science and there's a degree of diplomacy and all that you're doing here.

I'd like to ask you to take it maybe a step further on the diplomacy side in terms of how you are prioritizing and managing your members in the mission EIBC. And more importantly, maybe you could share with us, are there any certain goals that you find are less open to compromise or playing the slow game in policy discussions? Is perhaps something that you have to take on that maybe you favor or don't favor but have to because of the position you're in?

 

Laura Sherman:

Yeah, so how we figure out our policy priorities is, as you might imagine from what I've said already, very member driven. We do so every two years with our members. We do it on the legislative calendar. But we have priorities for all three branches of government in Michigan that we define with our members in that open discussion and list of ideas and then voting and feedback and culling of ideas down to the final policy priority.

I think that I'm not sure that there are specific goals that are less open to compromise just as someone who, I'm very practical and I think we all are and always want to get to a solution. So it's hard to say that there's nothing that we wouldn't compromise on. I think there's some things that we find ourselves having to compromise on more often because they're more strongly opposed by other folks. And there are some things that when there's less opposition, you can more easily get things done without compromise.

I'll give you one example to lay the framework. So, we've had members who've been very interested in changing the taxation status for utility scale solar project for years. And there was a group of members without our participation went ahead and got legislation through in Michigan that would've required much lower tax regime through a payment in lieu of taxes system. The Governor actually ended up vetoing that because the local governments were opposed. And we had not participated in that process essentially because we thought that a compromise would've been a better way to go than simply riding over the local governments on that issue. We had other members who felt that way as well. We didn't have a consistent member position on that. We then took two years to rewrite that legislation. I spent countless hours in work group. We finally came up with a compromise. All the local government groups were either neutral or supported it. All of the development groups, utilities, supported it. The Governor's office supported it. It passed the House with one or two no votes and flew through the Senate, signed into law at the end of this time period before they went on summer recess in July this year. And I think we'll really make a huge difference in terms of incentivizing local communities and developers on solar projects. It ended up being a win-win that a lot of our members are really excited about.

Just forcing it through didn't work. The long compromise which took forever, played the long slow game, which is hard for companies, easier for a nonprofit like us to do. And I think ends in a better result often.

 

Jason Price:

Yeah. I want to ask you about that. Can you think of other examples for our listeners where the MEIBC's had its impact or thumbprint on for outcomes that the state of Michigan now has? Could you share some of the practical everyday impacts that you think you could behind the scenes be proud to share that MEIBC has helped influence?

 

Laura Sherman:

I would start with some of these key pieces of energy legislation, the most recent being this legislation to change taxation for solar projects. We've also recently, actually multiple times, passed legislation to expand energy efficiency financing in Michigan to allow more types of projects to qualify for that financing. And prior to me, but when EIBC was very involved in the last revision of the state's energy laws, which was in 2016. If we were recording this in two months, I might be able to give you hopefully a huge win on clean energy legislation that we are in the midst of right now but I don't know where that's going to end up so I don't want to jinx ourselves. We're working very hard to get some key provisions that have been priorities for our members for a long time into that legislation.

And then I think in terms of at the Commission, we've had many, many positive successes in orders. And I think especially the easiest to see and recognize are some decisions that have made it into settlement with utility cases recently. So we have been able to increase the cap on rooftop solar over and over and over in successive cases. The cap right now for DTE is at 6%. It used to be at 1%. And for consumers energy it's at 4.5%. Again, used to be 1%. In those cases, we've also made sure that there's more renewables on the grid than originally proposed and made sure that certain amounts of those renewables are not utility owned, which tends to be cheaper, more cost-effective projects that are done through PPAs. We've seen improvements in the energy efficiency program, improvements in the electric vehicle program. So, those are all, I mean in general, the work at the Regulatory Commission is slow and incremental but some of those settlement wins, our big jumps. So those are probably the easiest to see.

And then I think at another key state level issue has been our influence on the state budget over in recent years. Especially last year, there was a big push by us and others to include funding for electric school buses. And I think it was a hundred... I don't want to give you, I think it was over a hundred million dollars in the school aid budget this year that we were successful in getting to roll out more electric school buses. And also we've included funding to help communities that want to site wind and solar projects, make sure that they get additional incentives for doing so. So those are both in the state budget.

I think even more, one of the most important things we've done, but it's very behind the scenes, is trying to get folks who are champions for the advanced energy industry and clean energy industry appointed to key positions in the administration. So, whether that's at the Department, at the Michigan Public Service Commission, even staff level jobs, encouraging our members to apply and to get folks making decisions on the inside who understand the industry and understand the value of having industry involvement, I think has been really important.

 

Jason Price:

That's an impressive record. Thank you for sharing that. I think that the audience will appreciate the hard work you're doing behind the scenes. So, Laura, we want to thank you for this and we want to give you the final word.

But we now have an opportunity to pivot to what we call the lightning round, which gives us an opportunity to learn a little bit more about you, the person rather than you, the professional. We have five questions we'll ask you and we ask you to keep your response to one word or phrase. So, Laura, are you ready?

 

Laura Sherman:

Yes. I will try to do one word or phrase. Okay. Ready.

 

Jason Price:

Good. You are from the East Coast and moved to the Midwest. What is it about Michigan that makes the state unique or special when compared to the rest of the country?

 

Laura Sherman:

Taxi drivers talk to you.

 

Jason Price:

Spoken like a true New Yorker.

 

Laura Sherman:

That was sort of a phrase but it's not well explained. Would you like me to explain it?

 

Jason Price:

Feel free to elaborate. Not a problem.

 

Laura Sherman:

I'll violate your lightning roll round. When I first came here, it's not only taxi drivers, but people in line at the supermarket. We'll ask you, "Oh, what are you making for dinner with that?" And the cab driver, "Oh, when did you move here? What's dah, dah, dah?" And coming from the East Coast, my first reaction was, what do they want from me? What are they trying to steal? What are they selling? And no, they're just being nice. That's just how it is.

 

Jason Price:

What's your favorite comfort food?

 

Laura Sherman:

Macaroni and cheese.

 

Jason Price:

What's the first major splurge you'd make if you won the lottery?

 

Laura Sherman:

I think I would buy a beach house on the Outer Banks.

 

Jason Price:

What would be an alternative career path if you had found yourself elsewhere than the energy industry?

 

Laura Sherman:

I would probably have been a dog trainer.

 

Jason Price:

Who were your role models growing up and who are they today?

 

Laura Sherman:

My parents growing up. Today, probably those incredible women who I mentioned from 5LakesEnergy, especially Liesle Clark and Amy Scripps.

 

Jason Price:

Well, that was great.

And Laura, from our research and background getting prepared for this podcast, can say that Michigan has no mountains because people like Laura Sherman have moved them all. You're doing great work out in Michigan. Keep it up. We want to thank you for being on the episode. We have now an opportunity for you to give closing remarks that you'd like our listeners to take away from today. What would that be?

 

Laura Sherman:

It would be, it's most important, I think, for your listeners to understand that the advanced energy industry is really pushing the envelope, developing new technologies and systems that can really benefit all customers and benefit utilities. And it seems like there are good opportunities to work together to harness all of that learning, all of those new technologies, to really create the grid of the future in a way that benefits the utilities as well as the industry and customers. I see a lot of opportunities. I still think there's some mountains to move, otherwise we wouldn't keep doing what we're doing. But we've seen a lot of opportunity and I think there's a lot more coming.

 

Jason Price:

That was a really insightful conversation and we really appreciate your time. We know you're a busy person. And we hope that our guests today stays engaged with the podcast community. And no doubt that there'll be people in the community who will be posting questions and comments for you to respond to. So, thanks again, Laura for joining us in today's episode.

 

Laura Sherman:

Thank you. It's been fun.

 

Jason Price:

You can always reach Laura from the Energy Central Platform where she welcomes your questions and comments.

And we also want to get a shout out of thanks to the podcast sponsors that made today's episode possible. Thanks to West Monroe. West Monroe works with the nation's largest electric, gas and water utilities in their telecommunication grid modernization and digital and workforce transformations. West Monroe brings a multidisciplinary team that blends utility operations and technology expertise to address modernizing aging infrastructure, advisory on transportation electrification, ADMS deployments, data and analytics and cybersecurity.

Once again, I'm your host Jason Price. Plug in and stay fully charged in the discussion by hopping into the community at energycentral.com. And we'll see you next time at the Energy Central Power Perspectives Podcast.

 

About Energy Central Podcasts

The ‘Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast’ features conversations with thought leaders in the utility sector. At least twice monthly, we connect with an Energy Central Power Industry Network community member to discuss compelling topics that impact professionals who work in the power industry. Some podcasts may be a continuation of thought-provoking posts or discussions started in the community or with an industry leader that is interested in sharing their expertise and doing a deeper dive into hot topics or issues relevant to the industry.

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The Energy Central Power Perspectives™ Podcast is hosted by Jason Price, Community Ambassador of Energy Central. Jason is a Business Development Executive at West Monroe, working in the East Coast Energy and Utilities Group. Jason is joined in the podcast booth by the producer of the podcast, Matt Chester, who is also the Community Manager of Energy Central and energy analyst/independent consultant in energy policy, markets, and technology.  

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